Christina states, ". . . the popular HBO drama about a Mormon family engaged in polygamy." Wrong. Mormons do not practice polygamy and haven't for over 100 years. Most people who practice polygamy have never been members of the Mormon Church or are excommunicated former members of the Church. Such callowness.

Seriously. It's pretty irresponsible to say that Big Love profiles a "Mormon" family. It spreads a stereotype that mis-characterizes the beliefs of millions of Americans. Please remember to check your facts.

Lazy reporting Bellantoni. The family shown on the Big Love series are not Mormons or more properly members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. The Church discontinued the practice of polygamy in the 19th century. Please be more careful about reporting this issue as it leads to confusion and unfair slander of practicing members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.

Uh... I agree with John. "Big Love" is not about Mormons. Their first episode made it very clear that it was not. Mormons have not supported polygamy for over a 100 years. Anybody openly practicing it now would be excommunicated.

I really am tired of hearing about Mormons every time Mitt's name comes up. Ger a life. Be concerned about the real things that will make him the best president ever.

People from the LDS church need to stop getting all worked up about the Mormon name. Growing up in the LDS church, we didn't want to be called Mormons. Just a couple of years ago the LDS church insisted the media stop using the Mormon name and say "LDS or say or spell out the proper name. Mormon refers to people that believe in the restored gospel of Jesus Christ as restored by Joseph Smith. The LDS church does not own Joseph Smith or the Mormon name. There are many religions that use the Book of Mormon and believe in Jospeh Smith. If the membership of the LDS church would quit making such a deal about the name Mormon fundamentalist, the media would to.

And viewers pay extra to watch such tripe? PT Barnum was right: there's a sucker born every minute! A CNN political analyst even announced recently "Romney isn't Christian," (discounting his prospects as a Presidential contender.

It's not just viewers, but networks, journalists with an F in Civics who create such slander and perpetuate it in the hope it follows voters into the voting booth.

I'm really disappointed that the Times hasn't taken down this prejudiced piece, or at least significantly edit it.

The clarifying update will likely be left unread by many who will wonder about the validity of plural marriage in the LDS Church.

It was banned over 110 years ago and it's time for "reporters" including Bellantoni to stop hampering on the fact that Governor Romney is a Mormon. The American people don't care about the Governor's religion, as long as he's religious to start with.

Let's make this process of choosing the next president one about the actual politics of the candidates, not about the anti-Mormon beliefs of a very small amount of our country, most of whom seem to be reporters.

I'm really disappointed that the Times hasn't taken down this prejudiced piece, or at least significantly edit it.

The clarifying update will likely be left unread by many who will wonder about the validity of plural marriage in the LDS Church.

It was banned over 110 years ago and it's time for "reporters" including Bellantoni to stop hampering on the fact that Governor Romney is a Mormon. The American people don't care about the Governor's religion, as long as he's religious to start with.

Let's make this process of choosing the next president one about the actual politics of the candidates, not about the anti-Mormon beliefs of a very small amount of our country, most of whom seem to be reporters.

Oh, for Pete's sake. To say fundamentalist Mormons aren't "Mormon" because they don't pay their dues to the official LDS Church is like saying people aren't American if they don't belong to the (Republican, Democrat, Green... take your pick) Party. They believe in Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon -- that makes them Mormon and not Baptists. It's a bigger term than some people would like to make it.

Actually they are Mormons, they are "Fundamental" Mormons, as opposed to LDS Mormons... both practice from the book of Mormon and have the same roots, but have separated in to different churches... its just like how Lutherans and Baptists are both Protestants... LDS and Fundamentalists are both Mormons, just of different sects.

Totally agree - do not use "mormon" as an adjective for this family!!!

The LDS has arrogantly tried to own the Mormon religion name. That is equivalent to the Catholic Church owning the 'Christian' name.

Readers, there are more flavors of the Mormon faith than the LDS is willing to accept.

The LDS abandoned some of the Doctrines and Covenants in the name of government appeasement.

To fundamentalist Mormons, that is when the LDS left Mormonism.

No one religion owns the Mormon tag just as no one religion owns the Christian tag, the muslim tag, etc., etc..

"...the family ceased being active in the Mormon church when they began living 'The Principle' of having plural marriages." Yea, I guess you would cease being "active" if you were "excommunicated" (kicked out!) DUHH!

Your logic is a little lacking to say the least Charles. The LDS claiming the Mormon name as theirs is akin to the "Roman Catholic" church claiming "Catholic" as theirs. Not Catholics trying to claim "Christian" as their moniker as you state.
When people break off from the Roman Catholic church for example, and still call themselves "Catholic", it does not make them such. The same applies to those who want to call themselves "Mormon," but are not. You either are or you aint.

No, the LDS Church does not "own" the name "Mormon." However, it makes perfect sense for the LDS Church or its members to want to clarify every time there is a reference. You or anyone else is welcome to use the name "Mormon" to refer to excommunicated members of the LDS Church, as long as you understand the difference between the LDS Church and polygamist sects--and it seems like many of you do.

Where the rub is is that many, if not most, who read this piece or any other don't know the difference. I, as a practicing member of the LDS faith am not personally offended if a polygamist is referred to as a "Mormon." However, I do want to make absolutely sure that all who are listening understand that that person is not a member of the LDS Church. As long as that distinction is made, everyone will probably be happy.

Why are we saying that a person's religious affiliation has nothing to do with their politics? That is nieve. Look at Bush. This country loves to be PC, but too much so. It is ignorant to say that someone's religious beliefs will have no effect on their presidency.

Polygamists are the original Mormons. The current brand of LDS are the splinter group. Joseph Smith was the first to practice polygamy and Brigham claimed that any Mormon who didn't was in apostacy.
Mormons try desperately to distance themselves from polygamy and claim that they no longer practice it, yet they still believe that men are able to have as many wives in the afterlife while women are relegated to one partner.
Also, when I was growing up in the church, it was taught that the practice would eventually be restored.

Romney has that drank-the-Koolaid glazed look of a religious cult member.

I don't care if Mitt Romney has 5 wives, 1 wife, or has sex with a Manequin....he's everything America doesn't need! Another devisive man...who Loves war...he's a disgrace!

Romney is a flip-flopper. They used the term on Kerry in the last election so why not be consistent. Romney says one thing to get elected and then does another once in office. When he ran for governor, he talked and sounded like an moderate but once in office, he flipped into a conservative. Maybe he's not a flip-flopper but just a real good LIAR.

The show, which I watch and enjoy, did make clear that today's Mormons do not condone polygamy. Further, a side plot revolves around the LDS efforts to fight polygamy and to address the problems it creates for girls and women. In this show, the LDS faith shines, and the polygamist "compound" appears positively hellish.

I agree with the person who said that most Americans don't care about Mitt's religion, as long as he is a person of good character who demonstrates an understanding that there exists something greater than we humans, something worthy of our reverence, something that inspires awe. Good people appear in all religions, including athiesm, as do not-so-good people.

Mitt is my second choice for president, my first choice is a Democrat. Romney's political career has shown him to be a good leader with the ability go get things done, and done well.

David Glick: When people break off from the Roman Catholic church for example, and still call themselves "Catholic", it does not make them such.

You may want to look into the Eastern Orthodox Church.

Or, you know, even just the definition of "Catholic" and its use in theological circles.

A quick search on google supplies some interesting results:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catholic

http://www.catholicswithoutachurch.org/catholic.htm

http://anglicanhistory.org/sspp/prestige1927.html

http://www.mgrfoundation.org/orthocorner.html

There's a reason it's called the "Roman Catholic Church." If "Catholic" were enough to distinguish the church all by itself, then you wouldn't need the "Roman" modifier.

I seem to remember watching a special last week on ABC about a community in Utah that still practices polygamy and they are Mormons. So what is it? They said as long as they were not married by law but only the church then what they do is not wrong. Seems kinda like saying its ok to steal as long as I give my spoils to another person.

The Mormons in this room need to lighten up! You all have played the victim card for too long. "Oh I am being oppressed I am a Mormon...no one understands me and my religion." BOO-HOO. For all you "LDS" cry babies on here when was the last time you actually stood up for true freedom of religion. My only experience with your faith is one of closed-minded, divisive people. Be thankful people have stopped calling your religion a cult and get over yourselves

To Open-Minded Moderate: If you vote for Romney, you vote for the Republican Party and what it stands for.

If you believe in what the Democrats stand for, then there is no way you can vote for the current Republican Party. Do you understand the differences between the parties?

Not many people know that mormons wear cheesecloth ful length undergarments 24/7 in preparation for The Rapture. Am I lying?..... and their biggest ritual is baptisms for the DEAD. Believe me, this polygamy is no big deal compared with the stuff they are really up to behind closed doors.

Josehp Smith a 12 year old boy was visited by an angel and lead to gold tablets which no one else ever saw, and he translated them by himself into a book of mormon scriptures. Tom Cruise Scientolofy is tame and comical compared to this mormon stuff.....

Romney can not expect to play off his religious credentials when wooing the religious right and then declare it off limits when questioned on his religion. if he did not want his Mormon faith questioned he should leave religion where it belongs, in the churches not in government.
The Family on Big love follows the Book of Mormon, though they are not LDS
It is fair to call them Mormons it would be incorrect to call then LDS

Mormonism is that strange religion where the founder had magical spectacles to read hidden gold plates, allowed polygamy, and massacred folks sent West looking for him. Great religion!

What's the difference? All religions essentially believe in an "invisible friend". I had an invisible friend when I was 5. I grew out of it along with the Easter bunny and the tooth fairy. There is no way I'm voting for anyone who still fervently believes in an invisible friend and (this is critical) uses that friend as leverage to win the presidential race.

That being said, if Romney doesn't expound on his beliefs during the campaign, I'll give him a fair chance and I'm not going to be swayed by the media who answers to their own invisible friend: Money.

I think more people would believe there is a concrete difference between the modern LDS church and polygamists if LDS didn't turn a blind eye to the polygamists living in their midst. It's hard for the rest of us to take seriously the claim that LDS has really outlawed polygamy (which they said they were doing only because Utah couldn't become a state otherwise) when the state basically sanctions polygamy in that it fails to prosecute most polygamists.

The Mormom practice of polygamy may be disturbing to some but I would consider converting except for the whole no drinking thing. I like my booze better than my wife.

I had the same experience in the LDS church as Blake in being taught that the divine practice of polygamy would be restored in the afterlife. If this is what the church teaches, then Mormons (LDS), have to accept that they still believe in polygamy. Isn't it hypocritical to deny that they believe in polygamy, and at the same time look forward to practicing it in the afterlife?

To Open-Minded Moderate,
I agree that good people exist in all religions and that the Mittster is probably a "good" human being with good intentions. However, I think you don't fully appreciate what may separate your belief in something greater than we humans, which is worthy of reverence and inspires awe, from Mitt's belief. Simply put, he believes that you are wrong, unless you belief exactly as he does. No exceptions. No deviations. He and all LDS are absolutists. Their beliefs are narrowly perscribed and if yours differ, you are WRONG. They talk a good story about "free agency", but there is only one right choice, and if you make any other choice, you are wrong. Sorry, but that sounds too much like what we already have leading our country over a cliff.

Romney, what of his statement that he has been a "hunter" for his entire lifetime....when in fact he had only been out hunting twice.?

This man, Romney", is not "a Man".

I do understand the church is very secret about some of the specifics of the religion. This is a religion that has sells "magic underwear" for gosh sakes. So for all we really know they may still practice "The Principal" in some other form or fashion.

I imagine we look at the LDS now, as people will view Scientology 100 years from now. Think of Mitt Romney as a taller Tom Cruise.

You have to be kidding me. This story offends you somehow? This is the problem with America today. Everyone is just looking to bust someone else for not being PC (or sensitive to their needs). Quit your crying you Mormon babies. Its a BS religion anyway. Jesus was here in America? Yeah, and I am Knute Rockney.

"Big Love" is a great show! Extremely well written and acted. Most of the actors deserve serious "emmy" considerations. It's too bad that the Mormons feel so defensive about it. But the fact is that at this present time, Mormon polygamous communities abound in places like Utah, Arizona, Colorado, New Mexico, and Mexico. (See "Under the Banner of Heaven" by Jon Krakauer for further confirmation of this fact). One of the things I find most interesting about the show is that the main family (Bill, Barb, Nicki, and Margene), are reasonably rational, (albeit not without nerouses) people. In some very clever ways these characters serve to display the disfunctional condition of Mormon society in general. (Not a whole lot different than the greater American society). Religious extremism of ANY kind is incredibly harmful and destrucive. It flies in the face of the original purpose of true, compassionate beliefs and acts, which is the central message of all religions. Any commentary on this condition should be encouraged and supported by all clear thinking people.

-G.W.

Wow, what an organized response from LDS/Mormons. Despite efforts like this, you've got an uphill battle in convincing most Americans your church isn't a cult. The kool aid drinking missionaries who visit our neighborhood on a regular basis and harass people about religious choices are the clearest indication of what the Salt Lake City based church (whatever its name) is really about. They are aggressive, arrogant and intolerant of other's faiths. By your missionaries you will be known. The practice of post-death baptism is also incredibly creepy and silly while showing contempt for other religious traditions. And, by the way, how convenient Mitt Romney missed the Viet Nam war while being a missionary in France. He says he was available for service. If he was really available for service he would have volunteered for military service and served his country as well as his church.

Thor,
I hate to let you in on this, but the media doesn't always report everything correctly. They seem to mix everyone up pretty well and do as little fact checking as they can manage. The group that practices polygamy in Utah are not members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. They may say they are members, but they are not. The LDS Church does not allow its members to practice polygamy and haven't for over 100 years. Those that do practice polygamy are not recognized by the LDS Church and most have never been baptised members and are not on the records. You can't believe everything you hear on TV or read in the media about any topic. Best way to get the information you are looking for is from an actual member of the LDS Church or the LDS Church's official website: www.lds.org.

So . . .polygamists are concerned about being stereotyped as mormons? ;)

How comforting to see an image of the seated patriarch as his women stand by and or behind him.
That proves that all is well with the world.

And another thing..Mitts dog is lucky to have an owner who cares enough to let him ride.
Hereabouts we tie them to the pickup bumper and let them earn their keep.
My wife says that the dog had to ride on the roof because he does not vote.
I say that dogs are not allowed to vote because they probably would vote democrat and then the republics would never win anything..
Why does God hate dogs?

This whole argument is kinda funny.

The anger and embarrassment projected by the LDS members on this thread because polygamy is associated with "Mormon" just makes me laugh. Polygamy was a basic principle introduced by Joseph Smith in Illinois, in 1843. Brigham Young, Smith's successor, established polygamy in the Utah settlements in 1852. In 1862 Congress passed the Morrill law prohibiting polygamy. The Mormons fought tooth and nail for their right to practice polygamy and argued that the law breached the protections of separation between church and state. In 1887 Congress considered The Edmunds-Tucker Bill. This bill threatened to confiscate all church property (except chapels) in excess of $50,000, and to dissolve the church as a corporate entity. This law was approved in 1890 by the Supreme Court.

Not until then did Wilford Woodruff, the fourth "prophet" of the church, declare polygamy prohibited.

For today's LDS members to be so up in arms about the association of polygamy with their church just makes me think that they would prefer the teachings and the history of the church to remain in the shadows as long as it can. The original Mormons were willing to fight all the way to the Supreme Court in order to preserve their cherished belief in polygamy -- the church representative, George Reynolds, actually went to prison as a result.

I, and many others who have studied the history of the church, would argue that those who left Woodruff's church and splintered off to practice the principle of polygamy as part of their religious faith are the REAL Mormons. Those who followed Woodruff's prohibition are the secular Mormons whose Earthly cares were and are more important than the principles set forth by the original "prophets."

The LDS members who prefer that moniker do so out of embarrassment with the origins of their faith. It is better that they refer to themselves as LDS because they certainly are not the Mormons that settled Salt Lake.

So, after that bit of history, I just want to say -- the LDS folks make me laugh because in actuality, it is more proper to associate Mormon polygamists as Mormon because they are the true followers of the original principles laid out by the founders of the church.

Obviously the mormons are ashamed of their polygamist background, but I would be. Moreover, I would love to be a polygamist if it weren't for the Mormon part. It would be like the Spearmint Double gum, but triple, quintuple the pleasure. Vote for Romney!

Modern genetics have conclusively proven one of the central tenets of the Mormon cult wrong. The claim that the native Americans came from an evil tribe in the Middle East centuries ago contradicts genetic analysis and is demonstratively false. So why would anyone continue to belive in all the other nonsense in that book and try to convince us that it does not show poor judgement which should disqualify him for public office? If a candidate claimed he believed he was abducted by aliens, shoudn't we be concerned? How is an alien abduction belief any more ridiculous?

Wow, such drudging for "the Church". Get a life and think for yourself.

Many interesting comments already.

I, too, believe one's religion is a material consideration for me to use in deciding for whom to vote.

I've known good mormons and not-so-good mormons. The people, that is.

As to the religion, there's also a whole lot of hair splitting going on in these comments.

I personally do NOT want to see Romney elected. That's partly because of his particular flavor of faith, but mostly because he has demonstrated -- quite obviously -- the willingness (very similar to how the incumbent conducted himself prior to Nov 2000) to say what he needs to say in order to get elected but turn around and do differently (what would have been predictable to many) once he has obtained the power.

I believe Romney essentially betrayed the people of MA and will most certainly do the same if elected president.

I know there are Dems who are also prone to this flip-flop kind of politics. This is NOT the only consideration, but it IS a major factor for me.

To believe in Joseph Smith's tale of angels, special rocks, and golden tablets hidden in a New York hill...well, one would have to be a Mormon. Would such a person not be a bit too credulous to be President?

The family follows the teachings of Joseph Smith and are, therefore, Mormon. They are not followers of all of the present day LDS policies (which include, by the way, only recognizing men of color in the 1970's - not very evolved, is it). Some can argue that they are actually truer Mormons because they are following the original tennets and structure of the "church".

I think it is fair and valid for people to consider Romney's involvement in this religion when assessing his character and determining if he should be our president. A candidate should be evaluated on the decisions they make and the choices they make. To make a choice to particpiate in the LDS reflects a great deal about Romney's thought process and decision making ability.

This entire discussion illustrates one of the main themes of "Big Love," which is probably the best written, most well acted drama on TV today. The actual Mormons (not the Richardson family and the polygamists) in the show are uptight about and very defensive about their polygamous past as apparently are those who keep pointing out that the LDS church abandoned polygamy in the 19th century (a necessary condition for Utah becoming a state). The show is basically about the tension between the mainstream LDS church and its "fundamentalist" sects that strive to keep the polygamous principle alive in the face of ridicule and scandal. To say it has nothing to do with Mormonism is either naive or willfully obtuse.

Well, you can certainly understand why Mormons and Scientologists are so defensive. It's so inconvenient and embarrassing when people talk about the actual traditions of those cults.

I don't know why the idea of plural marriage gets so many people so riled. Okay, I've heard the stories about underage girls being forced to marry old men. There are laws to prevent that and rightfully so.

"Big Love", which is an awesome program, has dealt with such abuses quite seriously, and the central family has made no bones about its opposition to such practices.

But that aside, why should anyone care if a group of consenting adults want to have a multiple marriage? Are they afraid there won't be enough love left over for them?

I don't care if people want multiple spouses for religious or secular reasons. It should simply be their right. Like many others, I am tired of a government that feels it must play moral nursemaid to adults who cannot be shown as harming anyone else by what should be their private lives. And spare me the self-righteous prattle that says "it hurts the kids." Bull. Having violent parents, or irresponsible parents, or none at all is what hurts kids. Not having three mothers.

And no, I am not a Mormon of any flavor, nor a Romney supporter, nor a polygamist. One wife is already more than I can handle. Three would drive me wacko, but I salute any man who can survive it.

Just because a person calls themselves a Mormon does'nt mean they are a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter day Saints. Polygamists are excomunicated from the LDS church no matter what they choose to call themselves. "When Joseph Smith had finished translating the Book of Mormon he was still only a boy, yet in producing this book he developed historical facts, prophecies, revelations, predictions, testimonies and doctrines, precepts and principles that are beyond the power and wisdom of the learned world to duplicate or refute. Joseph Smith was an unlearned youth, so far as the learning of the world is concerned. He was taught by the angel Moroni. He received his education from above, from God Almighty, and not from man-made institutions; but to charge him with being ignorant would be both unjust and false; no man or combination of men possessed greater intelligence than he, nor could the combined wisdom and cunning of the age produce an equivalent for what he did. He was not ignorant, for he was taught by him from whom all intelligence flows. He possessed a knowledge of God and of his law, and of eternity". If the Book of Mormon is fiction created in 1830, why has'nt someone else written a similar book or demonstrated how it was written? Besides, if the Book of Mormon was fake you would'nt be able to get a very interesting sunday school curriculum from it. The entire sunday school Book of Mormon teachers manual is available on the lds.org web site...check it out and see if its just a clumsly little volume of frontier jibberish, or if its a vastly more complex ancient record of a group of people that were lead to this continent. That being said, I dont know if I'll vote for Mitt Romney at this time.

Actually, all religious superstitions are pretty peculiar to those outside the faith. How about someone born to a virgin who rose from the dead and took his physical body to heaven?

It's a bit hypocritical for Mormons to cry about the program Big Love and to argue that it does not represent a "typical" Mormon family when Mormons still to this day hold to the belief that polygamy will be practiced in Heaven. In fact, my father, who has passed away, expects to have at least 2 wives in Heaven, my mother (who has passed away) and his second wife.

Ok, hold it! I agree a distinction should have been made in the article that "Mormons" do not traditionally practice polygamy HOWEVER "Mormon" is not a term owned by the LDS church. There are many people who believe in Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon (myself included) but who do not agree with the LDS church's path after Joseph's murder. There are many different types of Mormons, the LDS church, who do not practice polygamy, are simply the largest and most vocal branch.

For excellent, scholarly disscussion on this topic visit www.sunstoneonline.com

Read "Under the Banner of Heaven" If you don't believe they are a cult-well someday we may elect Jim Jones or David Koresh (or maybe already have). They are a secretive practicing religion who don't respect women except as vehicles for babies & men. Big Love does elucidate the craziness of the whole religion whether it is the fundamentalists or main stream practicing group. They named a university after a man that believes he spoke directly to god who told him to marry children. The people in "Under the Banner of Heaven" believed they talked to god also & killed a woman & child as a result. This is a cult. This is pedophilia. What is happening to the Catholic church will eventually come out about the LDS. Even in main stream LDS, girls are raised to marry as soon as possible & have as many kids as possible (who has flown into or out of SLC?) and not to be intelligent, independent individuals. Any "religion" that has so many secret practices is a concern. But, having said all that, Mitt Romney should never be president because he will perpetuate the staus quo. And what kind of person names their child Mitt?

For those of you faulting Mormons for being too sensitive about the issue of polygamy, try to think about it this way. Say you're a Democrat. Wouldn't you get annoyed if every time someone mentioned any prominent Democrat, people went off on a tirade about slavery? I mean, after all, the Democrats were pro-slavery and segregation until at least the turn of the century. This is how LDS people feel when the media and other people incessantly focus on polygamy. The practice has no effect on our lives as Mormons, and hasn't for generations, yet that's all anyone ever wants to talk about.

Also, and this is the general rule anytime the Mormon religion comes up in blogs and message boards, the inaccuracies, half-truths, and outright lies are staggering. I would advise those of you who have questions about the LDS church to ask members, and even then to corroborate anything you may hear from them with official sites like lds.org.

Wow, what great comments! I'd like to leave you all with one more thought:
It is the height of self-serving hypocrisy for present-day members of the LDS Church to continue to believe in the doctrine of Plural Marriage (which, according to their own scriptures, they do), while at the same time encouraging or approving of the persecution of those who choose to practice it.
Why does the LDS Church disapprove of present-day polygamists? Because their existence embarrasses them. How sad.

Jeremy,
As a Democrat, I am never annoyed when people rehash the past ideological practices of my party, because we don't believe in nor practice slavery and segregation anymore. It only serves to better inform and to help us never return to that way of thinking. The difference is that LDS still belief that plural marriage will be practiced in the highest degree of heaven by THE most righteous saints. It will be a reward for a well-lived, righteous earthly life. Is this correct? Is this what you believe as a practicing LDS? If this is what members are taught, then how can you say plural marriage is not relevant now? Everything the LDS church is about is being rewarded for living the Gospel on Earth so you can be rewarded in Heaven.
Also, can you be more specific about inaccuracies, half-truths, and ourtight lies you are reading on the internets? Sometimes, the things that seem exaggerated by outsiders, have their origins in, and are perpetuated by, members themselves. A good example is "magic underwear". I have heard many stories, as I'm sure you have, while sitting in Sunday School or Sacrament Meeting, about how garments have spared lives and limb. "Sacred garments" becomes "magic underwear".

Mitt Romney is a demon possessed man.

Such callowness??? My, my, my. The LDS were forced to give up polygamy by the government. Given the chance they WILL go back to it if not all at once then incrementally.

I will not vote for this smooth central casting
conservative. Republicans do not deserve another
chance to corrupt this nation. Romney has been
trained from birth to argue around any obstacle.
Abortion? No problem. He did the same thing
Como did in NY. I never liked the Como but he
didn't turn around and reverse himself when
it was politically expedient.

I do recommend Mormon dietary practices, however.
No caffeine, alcohol, soda. Pretty soon I'll
be getting out the divining rod looking for
my "Dream Mine". Oh, and read "Under The Banner
Of Heaven" and you'll find out why Mormonism
keeps coming up.

Yeah, the inherent stupidity in this discussion is, well, shocking. You people haven't given this more than ten seconds thought. Seriously, to denounce claims just on the whim of a thought, good lord. You just reinforce the notion that human beings are stupid by nature.

Plus, before someone tries to pull out this "DNA and the BoM issue", I challenge you to read this. Yes, the whole thing. In fact, read this, too, while you're at it.

It's an issue when they say Mormons, because when most people talk about Mormons, they are most likely talking about the current Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, not the Fundamentalist LDS, who are the actual ones that practice polygamy. The only reason I don't like the term Mormon is because it's too broad in today's world. We know there are many LDS sects there are.

There is absolutely no archeological evidence to support the book of mormon. Furthermore, if joseph smith "translated" this book in the 18th century, why did he write in 15th century English?

Fundamentalist Mormons are just like Fundamentalist anythings.

Mormons, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Baptists, Seventh-Day Advantists, Church-of-Christ-ians, LDS, LSD, Cocaine, Satan.

Get a life and learn to think for yourself.

All men are polygamists but only some have the game (or "religion").

Two antennae are talking about a wedding they just went to. "The ceremony sucked but the reception was really nice!"

So someone set me right. If the polygamy depicted in "Big Love" is not representing a Mormon or "Joseph Smithian" mind set, what IS it representing? Catholicism? Lutheranism? Judaism? It takes place in Utah! There are any number of authoritative works and historical records identifying Utah and the "decendants" of Joseph Smith as followers of "The Principle."
More remarkably, a recent episode showed Roman's son using a "peep stone" to hornswaggle the followers into believing that he was Roman's chosen successor--just like the patriarchs of the religion did so long ago. So are you "Mormons" denying the legacy of the "peep stone"? Isn't this bit of preternatural shenanigans more indicative of your collective mind-set? Are you denying the legacy of the peep stone along with "The Principle"?
Catholics may deny the principle of The Inquisition, but that doesn't deny the historical record--or the possiblity that someone today might believe that it is their calling to burn heretics at the stake.

joe smith, now you just sound like an idiot. I advise you to read this. Honestly, in recent years, there's been massive archaeological evidence to support the BoM.

You do realize Joseph Smith had poor education comparable to that of today's 2nd graders. Did you know that if you were to translate the BoM to Arabic (a Middle Eastern language, mind you), that it flows perfectly in the translation? There is absolutely no grammatical change whatsoever.

I wasn't going to post again on this thread because I think that I made my point as well as did others who have made some great comments. But this I just had to address:

craig above wrote:

"If the Book of Mormon is fiction created in 1830, why has'nt someone else written a similar book or demonstrated how it was written?"

Well, for one, if you're looking for books that capture the theme of a fictional region populated by various humanoid races you will find great reading in Tolkein's "Lord of the Rings." It was written between 1937 and 1949. It has since been reprinted numerous times and translated into at least 38 languages, becoming one of the most popular works in 20th-century literature.

It was written by sheer creativity -- just like The Book of Mormon. Both contain heroism, harrowing battles between good and evil, quests and a mythology uniquely their own.

craig also wrote:

"Besides, if the Book of Mormon was fake you would'nt be able to get a very interesting sunday school curriculum from it."

Actually, even The Lord of the Rings fans have their own curriculum. The main story is followed by six appendices that provide a wealth of historical and linguistic background material. The immense and enduring popularity of The Lord of the Rings has led to numerous references in popular culture, the founding of many societies by fans of Tolkien's works, and the publishing of many books about Tolkien and his works. The Lord of the Rings has inspired (and continues to inspire) artwork, music, films and television, video games, and subsequent literature.

I let Wiki do the talking above.

The difference between the "Rings" followers and the Book of Mormon followers is that most of the "Rings" fans accept it as pure fiction, whereas The Book of Mormon followers believe it as reality. As a piece of literature, Joseph Smith's Book of Mormon, written in 1830, was actually very creative for the time -- and quite unique. But under real inspection the flaws in the language and mythology make it less believable as reality than even The Lord of the Rings.

Check this link out for an illustration of what I mean:

http://www.skepticsannotatedbible.com/BOM/index.htm

I don't get it. What is everyone afraid of? The LDS faith teaches family values, strong moral values, belief in an afterlife, following Christ, doing good works, taking care of yourself.

How Horrible! What terrible things must come from that? Everyone run away, run away!!!

A second note - to dismiss Romney based on his religion rather than his leadership & political stances, is just stupid. If you don't like him politically, don't vote for him. If you don't like him because he's LDS, you're just a scared bigot who isn't intelligent enough to see that his religion will have no more impact on him as a politician as anyone else's.

Here's your problem, abdiel. Tolkien was an Oxford professor, who was specialized in Anglo-Saxon languages. He had decades of education under his belt. Joseph Smith had education comparable to that of a 2nd grader.

Do you have to be so ignorant? How many times do I have to post this link? I have many reasons why I accept it as reality. Tolkien totted his book as fiction. Not Joseph Smith. And when you have physical evidence that SUPPORTS the BoM (as my link proves), it cats things in a while new light. For Smith to think it off from the top of his head is next to impossible. I would advise you to check out this link, too.

I think the concensus is that the Big Love family is from the Mormon tradition, but not LDS. I am neither of those, just raised Christian.

What I find most disturbing about many of these posts is that they take the "worst" and most easily assailed aspects of the Mormon religion and uses those to dismiss anyone or anything associated with the religion.

The spiritual (not philosophical) basis of most religion is similiar, in that one should take a leap of faith that something supernatural happened at a defining moment. Islam has Mohammed getting messages in a cave which are then transcribed (much like Joe Smith) and Christianity has as its defining moment the messiah coming back to life and then ascending into heaven, but only witnessed by disciples.

Any supernatural event can be described in such a way to seem rediculous. The LDS, the main Mormon faith, have moved on from worldly polygamy. Since their religion believes in a worldly prophet who translates God's will for the faithul, this is perfectly acceptable under the tenets of their faith.

Try to be aware that the lens of time and mass acceptance is the only thing that keeps your own religion from looking rediculous. The LDS church has many faults, which is fine, just don't rip apart the Mormon faith in the process. Attacking the practices of zealous missionaries is appropriate, if you are talking about the cultural damage that kind of behaviour can have when it comes from any religion.

Semper Fi,
Terry

"The difference is that LDS still belief that plural marriage will be practiced in the highest degree of heaven by THE most righteous saints."

Plural marriage will only be practiced by those in heaven that married twice while on this earth. It has nothing to do with their relative level of righteousness. You don't earn the right to be a polygamist, it's just that if you're sealed to more than one person in this life, many believe you will be married to both in the next life.

"It will be a reward for a well-lived, righteous earthly life. Is this correct?"

No. You're making it seem like it's a Muslim-esque 17 virgins type of thing. It's not. Polygamy in the afterlife is not a "reward." It's just a reflection of our belief that, if you get married twice in this life due to a spouse dying, you'll be married to both in the next life.

So, anyway, your post is one example of the half-truths and distortions you read everywhere on the internet. Here's another:

I do understand the church is very secret about some of the specifics of the religion. This is a religion that has sells "magic underwear" for gosh sakes.

We don't sell "magic underwear." We wear the temple garment as a symbol of covenants we've made. All the "magic underwear" crap is an exaggeration cooked up by anti-Mormons. The temple garment is no different than garments worn by Orthodox Jews under their clothes. The church does not teach that the garment is magic.

So for all we really know they may still practice "The Principal" in some other form or fashion.

And for all we know Jews sacrifice Christian children and have horns! What a joke! If you have any evidence, any evidence at all, that polygamy is tolerated within the LDS church, present it. Otherwise, cut it out with the smears!

So, if us LDS seem a little testy, it's because everywhere we turn we see distortions of our actual belief presented as fact. It gets really old really quickly.

Um, this is precious, Johnson. I clicked the first link and what do I find? I read: "The server for Jeff Lindsay's Cracked Planet was unable to divine the intent of your selection.."

I know you Mormon types believe in strange things, but you actually refer to websites that try to "divine the intent" of my selection? Come on, you gotta laugh at the irony!

Your argument about Smith's education level compared to Tolkien's just illustrates my point. Smith's book is full of absurdities and plagiarisms -- an educated person would know better than to present such flaws. Smith may also have been uneducated in literature and the arts, but he was very much influenced by his environment which at the time was the of town of Palmyra in New York state. This region was an area of intense revivalism and religious diversity during the Second Great Awakening. Although Smith had limited involvement with organized religion during his youth, he was religious, and influenced by folk religion.

It is easy to grasp how a young man of 20 years could take the folklore of the past and write a creative piece of fiction based on it -- just because Smith was without formal education doesn't mean that he was stupid. Uneducated people have come up with lots of great stories for hundreds of years -- and almost always those stories were based on folklore passed from generation to generation.

And, of course Tolkien "totted" his books as fiction -- he WAS an educated man who didn't try to make absurd claims to the contrary. He also didn't think that any other educated person would believe them to be fact. Smith, on the other hand, DID claim his story to be true life...the story that gives me a laugh is how God made dark skinned people dark because they had to marked as sinners of some sort -- hilarious...if wasn't so offensive.

I don't want any of this to leave one believing that I don't appreciate Smith's book as a piece of literature -- despite the absurdities and plagiarisms. He was able to take the cultures of Biblical times and creatively transport them to the America's giving them a native touch. That is clever, smart and decent -- Smith had the intuition to project the possibility that the European and Middle Eastern societies of Biblical times might not have been the only ones to have achieved the label of "civilization." In that sense, Smith's book was very creative for the time.

Anyway, I personally don't care if someone believes the Book of Mormon to be fact. I don't care if people believe that the sea parted for Moses. I don't care if people believe Mohammad went up to the clouds in a golden chariot. I just wish that the believers would just keep it to themselves. Knowing the religious convictions of politicians is important to the political debate because kooks who believe the strangest things don't just leave it there -- they want to make the world according to their image -- and most of their images are based on creative fairy tales that have nothing to do with the real world we live in.

I have just spent a good amount of time reading all of these posts, and I have watched the show and could see why some Mormons might be offended by the show. It does show some of the darker sides (not of Mormons as a whole) of the religion. To be honest if HBO came out with a show about Catholic churches and the abuse of young children, I'm sure it would never air on TV, and loads of god-fearing, church-going folk would be outraged at the way their religion was being portrayed. I am not a religious person, I have been to the Church of Latter Day Saints, as well as Baptist churches, and have met a wide variety of people with a wide variety of beliefs. And the one thing I have learned from these people is the beauty of being human is that we all have the freedom of choice and the freedom to believe what we want.

If people are going to make generalizations of an entire religion based solely on what they see on TV, then they arent worth your time or energy arguing the validity of said religion. It only matters that you believe what you were taught to be true, no matter how ridiculous it really may be.....and that is the case in most organized religions....
What really matters are your moral beliefs.
No religion is perfect, and no one religion is the one TRUE religion. Just like all of the words I have typed were created by someone so were all religions. That is a basic fact that most deny. Despite that, they are all good stories :)